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07-17-2014 1 SOUTH MESQUITE DESIGN REVIEW BOARD 2 3 Following are the approved minutes of the South Mesquite Design Review Board 4 meeting held July 17, 2014 in 2007-A, City Hall, 700 N. Main Street, Las Cruces, NM 5 88001. 6 7 BOARD MEMBERS PRESENT: Faith Hutson 8 Robert Williams 9 David Chavez (arrived 6:15) 10 Barbara Kuhns 11 12 STAFF PRESENT: Susana Montana, CLC Planner 13 Becky Baum, RC Creations, LLC, Recording Sec. 14 15 16 I. CALL TO ORDER 17 18 Williams: Okay, we'll call the meeting to order at 6:07 p.m. 19 20 11. APPROVAL OF MINUTES -June 19, 2014 21 22 Williams: First item is the approval of minutes. I looked over them and I didn't have 23 anyissues. 24 25 Hutson: I didn't have any either. 26 27 Kuhns: I didn't have any issues. 28 29 Williams: We have a motion to approve the minutes. 30 31 Hutson: I'll make a motion. 32 33 Kuhns: I second it. 34 35 Williams: All those in favor. 36 37 ALL: AYE. 38 39 III. NEW BUSINESS - None 40 41 Williams: We don't have any new business or any old business. 42 43 IV. OLD BUSINESS - None 44 45 46 1 1 2 3 V. DISCUSSION OF OTHER ITEMS 4 5 1. A discussion of potential proposed amendments to the Municipal Code, 6 Article V, Section 38-49.2 South Mesquite Neighborhood Overlay Zone 7 District to enact text changes which represent substantive changes to the 8 overlay district zoning regulations. 9 10 Williams: Discussion of other items. 11 12 Montana: Well, under this agenda item I wanted to share with you what the zoning 13 review team commented on the Board's zoning amendments, proposed 14 zoning amendments and they support all but two and are suggesting an 15 amendment on one other. The ones they would like the Board to 16 consider, really think hard, is the expansion of your duties, they just want 17 to be sure that you'd be willing to meet maybe twice a month if there were 18 a lot of cases that came before you that were a part of the expanded 19 workload. And because management wasn't comfortable waiting a month 20 or maybe a month and a half for applicants who are just submitting a 21 building permit to have to wait that long, so they just wanted you to take 22 into consideration what the workload might be. Now during the building 23 boom, pre-2008, you know from 2005 through 2008, there were months 24 where they had several cases and so they just ... they just wanted you to 25 be cognizant of that. 26 One of the two things that they did not support was the requiring 27 you to review accessory structures that don't need a permit; that is less 28 than 120 square feet. Those ... they don't even need a permit so we 29 would never know if they ... you know if someone wanted to build it. So 30 they're suggesting that you scratch that from your list of additional duties 31 cause there's no way to enforce that. It's just; you know they might buy a 32 little shed from some dealer on Valley and have it taken to their lot. Now if 33 there's a complaint we can come in and try to get them to at least paint it 34 the same color as their house because we do have citywide zoning urban 35 design guidelines that say accessory structures should be painted the 36 same color as the primary structure. So we could do that but that's about 37 all we could do. So that's on page two of this item A little Roman numeral 38 four so they'd like you to scratch that. 39 And lastly they just can't get the City Attorney to agree to extending 40 the demolition delay past the 60 days. I met with Pete Connelly, who is 41 our City Attorney, and he says that based on case/court decisions 42 anything more than 60-day delay, mandatory 60-day delay, is a given and 43 the City would have to buy the property immediately in order to avoid 44 taking the property rights of the owner. 45 2 1 Hutson: I have a question about that. How do other cities get around that? 2 Because we've looked at a lot of places where they allow ... they have 3 180 days and things like that. 4 5 Montana: Is that in New Mexico? 6 7 Hutson: Well, the one I'm thinking of specifically is not, but I don't know. We could 8 check New Mexico. So is this like State law, is it City ordinance? 9 10 Montana: It's ... no it's State. In his view it was state court decisions, adjudicated 11 decisions. 12 13 Hutson: Okay. 14 15 Montana: And the problem is if you ... if this Board goes to Council with the minority 16 report that you want, the 120-day delay, he's there, the City Attorney's 17 right there you know sitting right next to the City Manager and they'll look 18 to him and he'll give this long spiel about no more than 60 days. So I think 19 ... I don't think we'll get it. 20 21 Hutson: Okay, I was just curious cause I know other cities have a longer amount of 22 time and that's something we looked at when we talked about trying to 23 get. 24 25 Montana: Yeah. 26 27 Hutson: Cause you can't even close a house in 60 days, you know, close a deal 28 typically so what if you wanted to buy a historic property to keep it from 29 being demolished, you couldn't get that through the bank in 60 days. 30 31 Montana: Well, if there was an interested buyer then the applicant could withdraw 32 the application and then that could (inaudible). 33 34 Hutson: Alright. 35 36 Montana: As long as that interested buyer still was viable. 37 38 Hutson: Okay, that makes sense. 39 40 Montana: So, and then well, management suggested that this Board and this 41 community, Las Esperanzas or another historic preservation organization, 42 be proactive and do what Barbara started to do which is inventory the 43 dilapidated adobe structures that are vulnerable to demolition or could be 44 and see if we could get funding to give it to a non-profit to rehab it and 45 bring it back to life and I have an example that I'm going to show you 46 tonight. 3 1 2 Hutson: Okay. 3 4 Montana: So that was their suggestion. 5 6 Williams: And it seems to me ... this is off topic a little I guess but I think that 90-day 7 delay is less useful; my concern would be that they would have to start 8 construction on it ... if they're given permission to demo something they 9 should start construction on something new within a certain amount of 10 time. I think that ... I mean to me it seems like I'd rather have ... if they're 11 going to demo something for construction ... 12 13 Hutson: That they have immediate plans. 14 15 Williams: That they have immediate plans to do it. 16 17 Hutson: Not two years later or something. 18 19 Williams: Not two years later or never, you know, and I know we discussed that at 20 one point. 21 22 Montana: Yeah. 23 24 Williams: And I don't know whether ... I can't remember ... 25 26 Montana: Well we asked ... 27 28 Hutson: That does make sense to me. 29 30 Montana: We asked that they give us a description of what they intend to do with the 31 property. We didn't ask that or require that they submit a permit for the 32 construction. 33 34 Williams: Yeah. 35 36 Montana: Because they may have an example today; they're not going to build on it 37 if they have to demolish it, it'll just sit vacant. 38 39 Williams: Cause we'll have to ... see how long that lot sits catty corner from you now 40 with nothing on it and you know it's like ... 41 42 Montana: Right. 43 44 Kuhns: And the one on the corner of Mountain and Mesquite. 45 46 Hutson: Yeah. 4 1 2 Williams: Yeah. 3 4 Montana: Yeah. So there's one more thing, the ZRT asked me to discuss with you 5 and that is this flexible development standards, in the revised zoning this 6 Board is asking that applications for this flexible, called flex waiver, come 7 here to this Board for recommendation to the director, Community 8 Development Director. And staff again thought that that would delay 9 these, what they call minor waivers, although not all of them are minor. 10 11 Hutson: Right. 12 13 Montana: You can have 100% setback reduction and up to 50% reduction in 14 parking. The director was not willing to agree to delaying those flex 15 requests. Usually we get one and it's reviewed that same Thursday in the 16 ZRT meeting. The ZRT meets every Thursday, so usually they're 17 addressed on a weekly basis and they felt that delaying it for the month, 18 the next meeting of this Board was too onerous plus the applicant would 19 have to pay for the public notice. So they were ... they really didn't want 20 to have to do that. They ... if it works out ... if the timing works out they'd 21 be happy for staff to bring it to you as a courtesy review similar to what I'm 22 going to do today but they didn't want the zoning to mandate that it be 23 brought to you before the director acts on it. So we can think about that. 24 We don't have to ... we don't have to decide today, but ... and I can give 25 you examples ... next month I can give you examples of flex requests that 26 we get, usually it's for a shade structure in the rear yard to reduce the rear 27 setback or carport in the front yard. 28 29 Chavez: I apologize for being late. 30 31 Hutson: I didn't even think you'd be here. I thought you'd have class tonight so, 32 that's a nice surprise that you came. 33 34 Chavez: I don't have class. 35 36 Hutson: Oh, aren't you teaching? 37 38 Chavez: (inaudible) 39 40 Hutson: Oh, it didn't make it. 41 42 Montana: David, would you mind coming around so the recorder can hear you a little 43 bit better. 44 45 Chavez: Right here? 46 5 I Baum: That's great. Thank you. 2 3 Montana: So David I was going over the ZRT comments on proposed amendments 4 and they're very supportive of most of them. A couple of them they want 5 you ... they want this Board to just rethink maybe the expansion of duties 6 because that might require a lot more work of staff and yourselves, maybe 7 even a couple meetings a month if we get a building boom again. So they 8 just want you to be cognizant of that. On page two, the highlighted page, 9 they want you to be aware that those small accessory structures do not 10 need a permit so there's really no way for us to bring you know ... since 11 nobody needs a permit to install these smaller sheds and that sort of thing, 12 there's no way to bring them to this Board. If we ... if you see any that you 13 notice what codes could do is try to get the owner to paint it at least the 14 same color as the primary structure, cause we do have urban design 15 guidelines for that. 16 17 Chavez: I have a question. If this accessory structure would have to be, would it be 18 in the back yard or does that mean that it can be put anywhere on the 19 property? 20 21 Montana: It cannot be in the front yard. 22 23 Chavez: Okay, that's what I wanted ... 24 25 Montana: It can be in the ... it has to meet setbacks. 26 27 Chavez: So it can be ... so it's not seen from the front? 28 29 Montana: Correct. Well, depends on ... 30 31 Kuhns: It may be seen. 32 33 Williams: It could be on the side yard. 34 35 Montana: Yeah. 36 37 Chavez: It could be on a side yard but then not specifically in the front. 38 39 Montana: Yeah. 40 41 Chavez: Okay. 42 43 Montana: Especially on a corner lot you might see it on one of the facades. Let's 44 see, oh the 60-day delay, our City Attorney is just insisting that he would 45 not support, he wouldn't recommend to Council to support a delay longer 46 than 60-days because court case, what do you call it, decisions find that 6 1 anything longer than 60-days is a taking of property rights and the City 2 would have to purchase that property right away, immediately purchase it, 3 at least in New Mexico. 4 5 Chavez: I thought we had found research in Albuquerque that they had a ... 6 7 Hutson: It wasn't in Albuquerque. It was in other states. 8 9 Chavez: It was in other states, okay. 10 11 Montana: So ... 12 13 Hutson: I will double check that but I'm pretty sure it wasn't anywhere in New 14 Mexico. 15 16 Montana: So my point being that since the City Attorney sits at Council meetings, 1 17 don't think we'd get very far with requesting you know lower than 60-days 18 because Council would look to him and he would say no. 19 20 Chavez: Okay, if I may, on a structure that was torn down, actually burned and then 21 torn down on the corner of Mountain and Mesquite Street, they started 22 demolishing the building within the 60-days and the building was gone like 23 on the 40th day of the whole thing. And we made calls to Carol McCall 24 and the city and we have council ... several Council people drive by and 25 stating the fact that they violated the 60-day and allowed it to be torn up 26 before the 60-day term. So that's the reason why this ... this little strip of 27 document, I mean, phrase is here is because who's ... who really 28 administers the demolition permit to make sure that it is exactly 60-days, 29 not 40-days, or start demolishing on the 30th day. That's the reason why 30 that's in there because of that particular building. And we have it 31 documented enough that we knew that it was being torn down and we 32 contacted enough people from the city staff and council to drive by it 33 actually being demolished before the 60-day. 34 35 Hutson: It actually went up to Santa Fe. 36 37 Chavez: Yes. 38 39 Hutson: They actually came down and met with City Council over that particular 40 incident, because it was a significant structure and nobody had a chance 41 to get in there and photograph it or anything like that before it was 42 demolished. 43 44 Chavez: We had been promised a statement that somebody from the city was 45 going to go and do the measuring and photographing of the structure, and 46 so ... and had agreed with the state saying we'll do that and ... 7 1 2 Montana: Gone. 3 4 Chavez: They did ... the city ... it's the city's fault. Okay. 5 6 Montana: Well ... 7 8 Chavez: That's why this is in here because the 120-day, 60-days, who's going to 9 administer that? Who is? Who's supposed to? Because it didn't happen. 10 11 Montana: Well ... 12 13 Hutson: Monitors it. 14 15 Chavez: Who monitors, I beg your pardon. Who monitors this because it didn't 16 happen on that structure and what happens if another structure comes 17 across and it's going to be demolished in 60-days and all of sudden it just 18 starts getting torn down before then, we don't have a leg to stand on here. 19 And it's sad when the State of New Mexico comes down here and asks 20 the city, why did it happen? And the city doesn't come up with a legitimate 21 excuse other than, oh it's gone, big deal. 22 23 Montana: Well, you know, I don't know about that case. I don't know if our director 24 or the City Manager waived the 60-days because it was deemed an 25 imminent danger or safety hazard, I don't know if that's the case, but on 26 the current rules that would be permitted. Compliance with that 60-days 27 may be waived by the City Manager or designee if it's determined that 28 immediate demolition of a historic structure is necessary to remove a 29 hazard to the health, safety, and welfare of the public. That's existing and 30 we're proposing that it remain, risk management will want it to remain. 31 32 Chavez: Okay. The issue is there was no communication. Even the Council folks 33 that we called down there and they drove by, they didn't even understand 34 why it was torn down because there was no communication, no 35 transparency. 36 37 Williams: Being that it was a fire that had ... that had gutted it for the most part, it 38 may have been that it was a safety issue, but what I guess what you're 39 saying is that who ... that if someone at the city made that decision, that 40 said okay yes it is a hazard and it can be demolished, but someone is 41 denying or ... 42 43 Montana: Well let me ... let me read on that same paragraph says, in such a case 44 the Community Development Department shall immediately notify this 45 Board, neighborhood associations, SHPO, and other pertinent 8 1 organizations and interested parties that demolition of the structure is 2 imminent. 3 4 Chavez: It didn't happen. 5 6 Montana: I know it didn't. This is new. 7 8 Kuhns: It's a moot conversation because nobody here knows. 9 10 Hutson: Actually ... actually the truth was this; the city did deem it unsafe because 11 1 remember getting an e-mail about it. The city did deem it unsafe. The 12 question was it had been burned almost a year ago and it had been in ... 13 remained in that condition for an entire year. So why all of a sudden in 14 less than 60-days did they decide that, okay now it has to come down. 15 Because it sat in that condition for nearly an entire year. 16 17 Chavez: Yes. 18 19 Hutson: So, there was an answer and that was the answer on it, however, there 20 was no notification to anybody including SHPO and that I think is where 21 the big problem is and that's what I think we need to work on trying to 22 rectify, is make sure that communication stays open. 23 24 Montana: Well this new ... 25 26 Williams: Application does go out. 27 28 Montana: This new amendment would at least address that notification. We're also 29 requiring proposal for redevelopment of the property with elevations must 30 accompany the demo permit application. This proposal shall describe a 31 potential or proposed development proposal for the property whether it is 32 for the ... it is proposed for the near or distant future. So that responds to 33 what you were saying, at least we'd like to know what they want to do with 34 the property. 35 36 Hutson: Okay. 37 38 Montana: And it goes on. So I think ... I mean if you want I'll put in the staff report 39 that you still want the 90-days, but ... 40 41 Williams: So I don't know that ... 42 43 Kuhns: Could we get a report of that ... that house we're talking about, the one on 44 the corner of Mesquite and Mountain? 45 46 Chavez: Is there a report that exists? 9 1 2 Kuhns: Could we ... could we ... 3 4 Montana: You mean the hazard report or? 5 6 Kuhns: Well we just would like to have some of these questions answered. 7 8 Montana: Gosh. 9 10 Kuhns: Is that possible or is that too much Susana? 11 12 Montana: I don't think we reported anything. I don't think there was ... 13 14 Kuhns: There's a record of anything. 15 16 Montana: Might be just one sheet that says you know we deem it ... 17 18 Kuhns: But you know one ... 19 20 Montana: A hazard. 21 22 Kuhns: David asked a question early on, who is in charge ... who oversees those 23 demolition permits? 24 25 Montana: Robert Kyle our building official. 26 27 Kuhns: Okay. Could you ask him about the house at Mountain and Mesquite? 28 29 Montana: Yeah. 30 31 Kuhns: That'd be great. Thank you. 32 33 Montana: Yeah. Report. 34 35 Williams: From the sound of it, whether it was a 60-day or 90-day it wouldn't have 36 mattered, it still would've gotten torn down even if it was 90-day, they 37 didn't wait for 60-days. They wouldn't have waited for 90-days so it 38 wouldn't have mattered, but in that case anyway. 39 40 Chavez: Sure. We tried ... several people tried to contact the owner and actually 41 did contact the owner they were just not interested in doing anything with 42 the property after it had burned and it had been sitting there a year and 43 she came up with a rude remark saying I'll sell it to you for $100,000 and 44 so we just stopped communicating. And then turns out that she owned 45 the land behind the house and there had been another historic building 46 there that had been damaged and she just dozed it and they tried to save 10 1 that one too and it ... she's ... Evans is the last name I believe. And they 2 were not interested period. They could care less about what was there 3 and ... just land. But we did try. 4 5 Williams: Be interesting to find out if there are fines or anything required if someone 6 does do that. If, I mean if she tore it down before the 60-days is there a 7 fine, you know then the property can at least be lien-ed so that if ... you 8 know ... 9 10 Kuhns: Right. 11 12 Williams: It's gone still but at least it's ... you know the only way we're going to get 13 people to understand that these laws exist is to make them pay if they go 14 against it. So it's like ... 15 16 Chavez: Totally agree with you. 17 18 Montana: Okay, I'll look into that see if we can at least do that. Get that by the City 19 Attorney. Lastly David, we were just now talking about flex, flexible 20 development standards. In our amendments we're requiring that 21 applications for flexible development standard waivers, flex waivers come 22 here for recommendation to the Community Development Director and 23 staff. Management said that they wouldn't want to support that because 24 usually we get a flex request and we address it the very next Thursday. 25 So, they're small waivers, de minimis waivers that they wouldn't want, 26 number one the applicant to have to wait a month depending on the 27 application month, or six weeks to come here, and they wouldn't want that 28 applicant to have to pay the public notice recovery fee which is about 29 $180. So, they said that if the timing was right they would bring it to this 30 Board through staff a courtesy review; you know if the timing was right, 31 they could wait a week or something, but they didn't want that requirement 32 to be in the zoning code. So that's something we could think about. 33 Now I have a couple of other examples I want to show you of some 34 permit applications that are not under the Board's purview right now, but 35 would be under the proposed amendments. So, let's go there. The first 36 one I think you're familiar with, I'm going to show you ... thank you Faith. 37 This is La Nueva Casita Cafe. You all know where it is, for the record it's 38 at 195 North Mesquite and that's the southeast corner of Mesquite and 39 Organ. 40 41 Williams: Good salsa. 42 43 Montana: The National Historic District Inventory deems it a 1948 building, but they 44 do not deem it a contributory building to the National District. The 45 applicant want's to replace the existing canopy which has metal supports 46 and metal, this is metal as well, with wood supports and wood with red tile. 11 1 2 Chavez: Oh great. 3 4 Kuhns: Sweet huh? 5 6 Chavez: I think that'd be great. 7 8 Kuhns: And those ... you know that house two doors down has ... 9 10 Chavez: Has the Spanish tile, that's a ... 11 12 Montana: Yeah. 13 14 Kuhns: Yeah there it is. 15 16 Hutson: Jeanie and ... 17 18 Chavez: Jeanie and Marika's house. 19 20 Hutson: Marika's house. 21 22 Montana: Yeah, so these are the examples of the (inaudible) characteristic, although 23 a block distant characteristic. 24 25 Chavez: And actually the rock house on the same side has tile, Spanish tile on it. 26 27 Montana: Oh I didn't show that here. Okay. So I was polling you all and you all who 28 are present here today said that for now you wouldn't ask that it be 29 brought before you but with the amendments this is something that would 30 be brought before you. Heather thought that she would like this kind of 31 thing to be brought before the Board with the new amendments. So, we 32 as staff are going to go ahead and approve this permit. 33 So let me show you the next one. This is a legalization of an 34 existing enclosure of the carport done without the benefit of a permit. It's 35 in Area 1; it's zoned R-2. There are two dwelling units on the property. 36 This is the property. This area here was enclosed without the benefit of 37 the permit. Both structures on the property are deemed noncontributory to 38 the State Historic District due to post-1980 alterations, so in the 1980 39 inventory it was deemed contributory, but in the 1994 inventory it was 40 deemed noncontributory because of the alterations. Again it's in Area 1, 41 just a block outside of the original townsite. But with the new zoning 42 amendments you would look at ... Area 1 and 2 would be collapsed and 43 you would look at everything. Right now under the current rules because 44 they're not deemed contributory you don't have jurisdiction over this 45 permit. This is the Organ side and this is the Manzanita side. This is the 46 Manzanita side and this is the illegal enclosure of the carport. Now what 12 1 they are doing, they have a permit in to correct the flooring because it was 2 just the concrete pad that they framed out and put plywood up. So they're 3 going to turn it into a dining room. So they have to correct the floor, put in 4 electrical and all that. And they couldn't get the permit until they brought it 5 up to city standards. And here's the structure again. Here's the second 6 dwelling unit. So there would still be a driveway ... this is an accessory 7 structure. Because this is the double frontage property, there's two front 8 yards, and so the 1925 building only has about an eight-foot front setback, 9 secondary front, and so they could ... if they wanted to they could extend 10 this out to that fagade but they're not, they're just keeping it back there. 11 And there's an existing I don't know how long that's been here, but we're 12 not going to require them to change that. 13 14 Williams: Questions, just sort of a clarification, you're calling that a front fagade or a 15 secondary front fagade basically cause it's a corner lot. 16 17 Montana: Corner lot. 18 19 Williams: But that still be ... is ... my understanding is that the front is considered 20 basically where the meter would be if it was there cause you have to have 21 sides, you can't have two fronts. 22 23 Montana: Well when there's double frontage for zoning purposes there's two front 24 yards, so let me go back ... 25 26 Williams: That's awfully restricted in small lots. 27 28 Chavez: Yeah. 29 30 Montana: Yeah. This would be the front, secondary front, this is a side and this is 31 the rear for that kind of a property. 32 33 Chavez: Question. Are you talking about maybe the front of the secondary 34 property in the back as being the front yard? You're not showing ... is it 35 specifically just for this ... the corner house because you said that there's 36 two structures on that lot. 37 38 Hutson: There are. 39 40 Williams: Yeah. 41 42 Chavez: So are you talking about the secondary front yard at the second property 43 on the same one? 44 45 Montana: No. No. This is ... this would be the front for that second dwelling. 46 13 1 Chavez: Yes ma'am. Yes. 2 3 Williams: Yeah. 4 5 Montana: And then that would be the rear side. There has to be at least a 10-foot 6 separation between these two structures and there is. 7 8 Williams: Although I don't know with the accessory building if that's the case. 9 10 Chavez: Well that house is right behind my house. And that little secondary 11 building has been there as long as I can remember. I do remember the 12 carport and before they put the roof on that house it was the only house 13 that had those, I don't even know in town who has them, decorative finials 14 on the corners of their house, on the roof, I mean on the pediment. A 15 house like ... very ... it came out of like from Mexico. It had these unusual 16 pediments, it had a porch, and it was kind of a neat looking old house that 17 1 can remember and then I came back for a visit they had the roof on 18 there, so ... but it was a neat old house. It also was a major drug house 19 and there was always police and shootings coming out of the house, so 1 20 don't know ... I imagine that there are new owners. 21 22 Montana: The Holguin family owns it. This second unit is occupied by a family of 23 four. This is vacant until they do the remodeling and then they'll rent it out. 24 25 Chavez: Okay. 26 27 Montana: But again, next year, I say it's next year cause I anticipate we'll adopt 28 these zoning amendments pretty soon, this would come under your 29 purview. I think that's it. Sorry, can't see this. This is just what he 30 submitted for his building permit. He's not making any changes. This is 31 the existing and this, the little accessory structure in the back. 32 Okay, so let me go to the last one. And this is a sad state. The 33 second Baptist Bethel Church, Bethel Second Baptist Church is the owner 34 of this property that has these two dwelling units. Their insurance runs out 35 the end of this month. The insurance wants to drop it, drop their coverage 36 of these ... this structure. So the church is asking this Board if you could 37 use your resources to find somebody who will rehab it. They don't want to 38 sell the property necessarily, they'd rather keep the property but they can't 39 afford to rehab it. The best they could do is board it up a little better than it 40 is but they consider it vulnerable and if you know anyone who I'm sure 41 they would you know give it rent free for a certain number of years, but 42 anyone who could rehab this structure, you all know where it is, the yellow 43 indicates the properties that the church owns. I advised Ms. Ann Henry 44 who's on the board of the church, that we really do not want it demolished 45 for a parking lot. There'd be strong resistance to that. 46 14 1 Hutson: Yes, there would. 2 3 Chavez: Sure would. 4 5 Montana: So you know we couldn't deny after 60-days, couldn't deny the demo 6 permit, but definitely wouldn't want it turned into a parking lot. So she's 7 asking if we could try to find somebody, they're designated contributor, 8 circa 1910. 9 10 Kuhns: Did she ... 11 12 Williams: If they don't want to sell it? 13 14 Montana: Well, right now they would rather keep it but partner with somebody who 15 would want to rehab it and use it. 16 17 Williams: 1 wouldn't know anyone that would want to put money into something they 18 don't own. 19 20 Chavez: Money into somebody else's property. 21 22 Williams: Yeah. 23 24 Montana: Well ... 25 26 Chavez: It doesn't make any sense. 27 28 Williams: It doesn't make any sense. 29 30 Chavez: To do that because why would you invest say ... just a number, $50,000 in 31 somebody else's property where in turn you're not going to get back the 32 $50,000 investment unless the church said well, a down payment to own 33 or ... 34 35 Hutson: To lease or ... 36 37 Chavez: It's ... 38 39 Montana: Turnkey or something. 40 41 Chavez: Turnkey thing. 42 43 Montana: Yeah. 44 45 Chavez: Whatever you know, that there's a possibility of being sold but if the 46 church is thinking somebody's just going to come in and fix it up for them. 15 1 2 Montana: No, no, no, for a lease, you know for a long-term lease or you know ... 3 4 Hutson: It'd be in lieu of rent. 5 6 Chavez: In lieu of rent. 7 8 Montana: Yeah. 9 10 Chavez: Well ... 11 12 Hutson: You know if you had like lifetime lease or something on it and you're not 13 paying. 14 15 Williams: Or (inaudible) 16 17 Kuhns: No one in this room is going to live long enough for that one. 18 19 Montana: Yeah, I think you know, if you know of anyone, a contractor who would be 20 interested. 21 22 Kuhns: $50,000. 23 24 Montana: Maybe they'd be willing to sell it, you know, it's ... right they're pretty 25 desperate. 26 27 Hutson: So maybe they'd be willing to sell it. 28 29 Chavez: We did a case with the folks that live right next door to that property. 30 31 Kuhns: I gave her the information. 32 33 Montana: Yeah. 34 35 Chavez: And she ... right off the bat, and the son also said if we found out anything 36 about that property they were extremely interested. 37 38 Kuhns: I already gave her the information. 39 40 Chavez: You did? Thank you, Barbara. 41 42 Kuhns: And so they might not have the money. 43 44 Chavez: Oh. 45 16 1 Kuhns: I mean I bet they want to buy it but whether they can or not, I don't know, 2 but she has all the information. And I've talked to other people about it. 3 4 Hutson: Does anybody have any idea what it looks like inside? It's partially 5 burned, correct? 6 7 Chavez: Does anybody ... there was a fire. That was one of the houses that 8 caught on fire. 9 10 Montana: Yeah, the roof is falling in. It's ... it's ... 11 12 Kuhns: What about ... 13 14 Montana: It's not secure so I peaked in and it didn't look very good. Most ... 15 16 Williams: It doesn't look very good. 17 18 Montana: It's about half gutted and they use it for some storage but they need to 19 secure it, completely secure it when their insurance runs out. 20 21 Kuhns: What about the ... that housing assistance? 22 23 Montana: Well I talked to the ... 24 25 Chavez: You mean Habitat for Humanity? 26 27 Kuhns: No. 28 29 Hutson: No. 30 31 Kuhns: The other one. 32 33 Montana: The city one. 34 35 Kuhns: No, the other one. 36 37 Hutson: Rose is ... Rose Garcia. 38 39 Chavez: Oh Rose Garcia. 40 41 Montana: Oh Tierra Del Sol? 42 43 Kuhns: Yeah. 44 45 Hutson: Tierra Del Sol. 46 17 1 Kuhns: Why don't they approach Tierra Del Sol? You know Tierra Del Sol did the 2 one on Court and Tornillo. 3 4 Chavez: And they did a wonderful job. 5 6 Kuhns: It's next door to the East Side Community Center. 7 8 Montana: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. 9 10 Kuhns: Tierra Del Sol did that. 11 12 Montana: No, actually the city did that. 13 14 Kuhns: No. 15 16 Chavez: No, Tierra Del Sol did the ... 17 18 Kuhns: Tierra Del Sol sold it. 19 20 Chavez: Their signs were all over the place when they were doing that building. 21 22 Hutson: Yeah, Tierra Del Sol did ... 23 24 Kuhns: And they met with us. 25 26 Montana: We funded it. I'm sure we participated. 27 28 Chavez: Well she sold it for a hundred and ... 29 30 Kuhns: Yeah. 31 32 Montana: Well I'll give them a call. 33 34 Kuhns: And also that program that that man talked to us about. 35 36 Montana: Well, I talked to the City about that and Vera Zamora who's the director for 37 the City's housing rehab program said that because it's a church, a non- 38 profit ... 39 40 Hutson: There we go. 41 42 Chavez: Oh gosh. 43 44 Montana: We couldn't fund it. It would have to be for an individual and that 45 individual would have to meet the low-income criteria. 46 18 1 Hutson: Do those people next door meet the low-income criteria if they could buy 2 it? 3 4 Montana: I think they probably ... not the low-income. 5 6 Chavez: I mean I would say that that ... the neighbors there would be more ... the 7 son is a contractor. 8 9 Hutson: He's not going to meet the low-income requirements then. 10 11 Montana: Yeah. 12 13 Chavez: No, but she. 14 15 Kuhns: She's going to retire soon remember, so she ... 16 17 Montana: Yeah. 18 19 Kuhns: She could very well likely meet those requirements. 20 21 Chavez: It doesn't matter where the money comes from. The son can bank her, 22 but I mean you know those have been boarded up ... 23 24 Hutson: Forever. 25 26 Chavez: Since the 12 years I've been back here and I don't even know how much 27 longer before then and it's just sad that they've just been melting away. 28 29 Montana: Yeah. So, you know, well I'll ask around. If you all can ask around and 30 get back to me, I'll get back to Ms. Henry. Ms. Henry's a receptionist in 31 our HR department so. 32 33 Kuhns: Okay. 34 35 Hutson: I think if Ms. Henry could get the Board to agree to sell it there'd be a lot 36 better prospects than the one to hang on to it. 37 38 Chavez: Yeah. 39 40 Montana: Ok, alright, I'll let her know. 41 42 Hutson: I think that would be a recommendation that we could make is that they 43 really consider selling it and just getting out from under all the liability on 44 that. 45 19 1 Chavez: Because there are sources out there that we could put that building up 2 and ... 3 4 Hutson: Right. 5 6 Chavez: And the word gets out ... 7 8 Hutson: But you can't the way it is now, nobody's going to ... 9 10 Chavez: And we could probably find a buyer for the property but if it's ... if the 11 church is going to want to hang onto it ... I ... 12 13 Hutson: It'd have to be a really sweet deal that they could get a very long-term 14 lease or something, something worth their while. 15 16 Chavez: Life or something like that or you know --- 17 18 Hutson: Thirty years or twenty years or ... 19 20 Montana: Okay. Well I will convey that to Ms. Henry and she'll convey it to the 21 board. 22 23 Williams: And I think that would ... they would still probably be even if you just have 24 an agreement for a long-term lease, their financing would probably be 25 difficult unless you had the funding yourself. 26 27 Hutson: Right. 28 29 Chavez: Exactly. 30 31 Williams: Available so it's like ... 32 33 Chavez: How are you going to get a bank loan on somebody else's property? 34 35 Williams: Yeah, exactly. 36 37 Hutson: You're not. 38 39 Montana: Well I'm going to buy my lottery ticket. 40 41 Chavez: Does it say the size of lot cause it has a pretty good size little bit of 42 backyard? 43 44 Hutson: You're going to buy a lottery ticket? 45 46 Montana: Yep. 20 1 2 Hutson: And call in rich one of these days? 3 4 Montana: Yeah. See if I can rehab some adobes. I'm happy with mine. Maybe I'll 5 buy mine huh? One more thing and that is the public meetings. 6 7 Hutson: Oh yeah. 8 9 Montana: We've secured, we've reserved the East Side Community Center for a 10 daytime meeting, afternoon meeting August 20th from 2:00 to 4:00 p.m. 11 and we've reserved the Weed & Seed Community Center for an evening 12 meeting Wednesday, August 27th. 13 14 Hutson: Will you turn the lights on David? 15 16 Montana: Now, I don't know how we're going to advertise these meetings, we'll have 17 to find out you know what our budget is. The management, ZRT was 18 concerned that we be sure that we advertise to people who now live in 19 Area 1 because that's going to be the biggest change for them. Their 20 properties are going to come under this purview and the heights are going 21 to come down, so I have to do ... I have to think about outreach to Area 1 22 in particular. 23 24 Hutson: I would suggest that you contact Weed & Seed. 25 26 Montana: Yeah. 27 28 Hutson: And if you put together a flier the kids are really good usually about ... 29 30 Montana: Yeah. 31 32 Hutson: About putting that out to. 33 34 Montana: Okay. We'll do. They do that. They do it all the time. 35 36 Hutson: That would be ... 37 38 Kuhns: Do Paul and Frank live in Area 1? 39 40 Chavez: Yes. 41 42 Montana: No, Area 2, on May? 43 44 Hutson: Yeah. 45 46 Chavez: They live in the historic ... the Federal Historic District. 21 1 2 Hutson: Yeah they're two ... 3 4 Kuhns: They're ... 5 6 Hutson: So that would be one thing. The other thing is Susana and I don't know, 7 you know off the top of my head I couldn't tell you who's Area 1 and Area 8 2, but it can go out to neighborhood watch and they'll ask them to 9 distribute to neighbors. 10 11 Montana: Okay. 12 13 Hutson: So I would do that for you as well, just send that out and ask them to make 14 sure that ... 15 16 Montana: In an e-mail or do you need fliers as well? 17 18 Hutson: Actually usually just e-mail and I just ask them that ... 19 20 Montana: Okay. 21 22 Hutson: To let people in ... I ask the block captains to please let the people in their 23 area ... 24 25 Montana: So make a flier, e-mail it to you all and then you could forward it to 26 everybody on your ... and David is there a (inaudible) preservation 27 organization? Are there ... 28 29 Chavez: The Mesquite ... yeah it's still there. 30 31 Montana: Do they have an e-mail or can you forward it to them? 32 33 Chavez: I can forward to them, yes. 34 35 Montana: Okay, cause I have Las Esparanzas e-mail and so we'll send it to them. 36 So I've just got to think about what kind of outreach, maybe a little display 37 and in the Bulletin and the Sun News advertising both meetings, and fliers. 38 1 don't listen to the radio but do a lot of people ... is there a public service 39 announcement we can use. 40 41 Chavez: You can get a lot of free public announcements on all the radios. 42 43 Montana: Radios. 44 45 Chavez: There's that new radio station the 98.7, there's 101. 46 22 1 Hutson: KRWG. 2 3 Chavez: KRWG, they all do free. 4 5 Montana: Okay. Ninety what point seven? 6 7 Baum: Ninety-eight point seven. 8 9 Chavez: Ninety-eight point seven. It's the new station. And then there's 101, and 10 then ... I mean all the radio stations. 11 12 Montana: Okay, our public information ... 13 14 Chavez: Even the country western stations do that. 15 16 Montana: Yeah our PIR, our public information officer can get that out. Okay. Now 1 17 just had a little example of maybe an agenda or ... 18 19 Kuhns: Looks good. 20 21 Montana: How we want to organize the meeting. 22 23 Hutson: Did you see that we can use pervious materials in many instances? The 24 zoning Board didn't have an issue with that. 25 26 Montana: Nope. 27 28 Hutson: And we can waive it for ... with concurrence of City staff. 29 30 Chavez: For parking? 31 32 Montana: Yeah, yeah. 33 34 Chavez: Cause I ran into Leslie Skaggs not too long ago and he asked, he goes, 35 does anything come up with the parking issue and I said I don't know. 36 37 Hutson: If you look at the ZRT comments, they don't have an issue with it. 38 39 Montana: Yeah, they're supporting that. 40 41 Chavez: That's great. 42 43 Hutson: So we are making some real progress. 44 23 I Montana: Yeah, what they want to do is support the communities' efforts to rehab 2 buildings, bring back businesses which are now stymied because of the 3 paving requirements, so they want to bring back life to the neighborhood. 4 5 Hutson: Thank goodness. 6 7 Chavez: I mean that could help La Casita, the parking lot in the back. 8 9 Kuhns: Yeah. 10 11 Montana: Yeah. 12 13 Chavez: With crush-fine instead of just the dirt cause they don't ... they can't afford 14 to pave. 15 16 Montana: Yeah. Can you hear that? We're trying to be a little bit better and not 17 talking over one another and talking aloud. 18 19 Baum: You guys are going awesome. 20 21 Montana: Okay. 22 23 Chavez: Okay. 24 25 Hutson: Yes. 26 27 Baum: Thank you. You're doing awesome. 28 29 Montana: So think about what we should present at the meetings and then e-mail 30 me if you want to add something. Carol McCall said she would help 31 talking about the history of the zoning and the Mesquite plan. And 32 guessing that Heather would do welcome and introductions, go around the 33 room, find out who are in attendance. And then we'll have some 34 handouts, maybe a questionnaire, do you like, you don't, you know what 35 you want to see? 36 37 Chavez: Are we going to show any type of example? 38 39 Montana: Sure. 40 41 Chavez: Some kind of a photo or something like this is the way it is, this is how it 42 could be. 43 44 Montana: Okay. 45 24 1 Chavez: You know so ... I mean a picture says a thousand words sometimes and 2 some folks may not understand. 3 4 Montana: I can have an exhibit. I don't want to do a PowerPoint cause people get 5 distracted and you know I lose their attention you know when you have to 6 turn the lights on and flip the machine on and all that, so I'd rather have 7 big poster board of the examples if that's all right. 8 9 Chavez: That's what I was going for. 10 11 Montana: That way we can walk around and ... 12 13 Chavez: Yeah. 14 15 Montana: Before the meeting they could look at things. 16 17 Chavez: I think that'd be a better idea than actually PowerPoint. 18 19 Montana: Okay. 20 21 Kuhns: Death by PowerPoint. 22 23 Montana: Yeah, yeah. 24 25 Chavez: I think sometimes PowerPoints are overdone. 26 27 Montana: Yeah. 28 29 Chavez: Oh, another PowerPoint, oh. 30 31 Montana: Yeah, I lose them. They look at their phone or go somewhere else in their 32 head you know. Alright I think that's all I had to bring unless you want to 33 raise an issue. 34 35 Hutson: David any more issues you want to raise? 36 37 Montana: Do you want to have a meeting in August? 38 39 Chavez: That was the only one I had been ... had a dream about. 40 41 Hutson: A meeting in August, your normal meeting? 42 43 Montana: Yeah, because the 20th is a public meeting and then our normal ... 44 45 Hutson: The 27th is a public meeting. 46 25 I Montana: Yeah and our normal meeting would be the 21st. So do you want to ... 2 3 Williams: Well I would say that if we have a case. 4 5 Hutson: Yes. 6 7 Montana: If we have a case. 8 9 Hutson: If we don't have a case. 10 11 Williams: We don't have a case, then no. 12 13 Montana: We don't have a case cause I would know by now. 14 15 Hutson: Okay. 16 17 Montana: They have to submit you know. 18 19 Hutson: Then I say no, especially if we're going to be at both those meetings. 20 21 Williams: Yeah. 22 23 Montana: Yeah. 24 25 Chavez: Also though on the property that's ... the church owns, would you keep us 26 informed as much as possible about if they're willing to sell it, anything 27 that would be positive toward selling the property because Faith has 28 people that she can put something on a website and all of us here and 29 then I know some other folks that would be biting at the bit to get the word 30 out to save those structures. 31 32 Montana: What I can do ... I can ask Ms. Henry to ask the board if they would put up 33 one of our big yellow signs with just my number you know, anyone 34 interested in this property call Susana and that way people driving by who 35 are not on our ... 36 37 Kuhns: Yeah, great. 38 39 Chavez: That's a great idea. 40 41 Kuhns: Fabulous. 42 43 Montana: To call me and then I can call the church or ... 44 45 Kuhns: I'll put it on my Facebook page. 46 26 1 Montana: Yeah, yeah, just get the word out. 2 3 Chavez: I can do the same thing. 4 5 Kuhns: Yeah. 6 7 Montana: You never know. 8 9 Hutson: That's true. You never know. 10 11 Montana: Okay. 12 13 Hutson: Perfect. 14 15 Montana: We'll do that. 16 17 Hutson: Call adjournment? 18 19 VI. ADJOURNMENT (6:54 p.m.) 20 21 Williams: Yep, move to adjourn the meeting. 22 23 Chavez: So moved. 24 25 Hutson: Second. 26 27 28 29 30 31 Chairperson 27